Islamic State

September 26, 2014

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At the Astrological Association annual chinwag a few weekends ago, the astrologer Geoffrey Cornelius, author of The Moment of Astrology, showed a chart for Islamic State, the group claiming hegemony across northern Syria and Iraq. His reasoning for this chart was convincing, (the founding of the Caliphate was timed to coincide with the beginning of Ramadan), and the chart itself is really powerful. Here it is.

Islamic State

I have had to adjust the time on my software by one hour to get the Cornelius chart. This is a software problem though, so the actual time is 7.05 pm if you are attempting to redraw the chart in your own program.

 

 

I wrote about Pluto in my previous post about open enemies. You can see here that this chart is dominated by Pluto, first it is on the Ascendant — and then it rules the Midheaven. Pluto and the Ascendant are also on the degrees of power in mid-Capricorn and of course, the US Sun would be on the Descendant in the house of enemies.

The murder of the journalist James Foley. Pluto.

The murder of the journalist James Foley. Pluto.

By March next year, Pluto will have come entirely out of the shadows of the 12th house by progression, and it may be possible then to destroy the Islamic State.

• Income from Neptune which rules oil, and Chiron which rules pain, in the second house.

• Jupiter-Moon conjunction in Cancer — irrational faith.

• Mars opposite Uranus — erratic, rebellious, violent.

• Without the outer planets, there are virtually no aspects. This thing is much bigger than the people involved.

• Venus in the 5th, aspected only by Neptune squaring her from Pisces. How does that describe what we’re hearing about rapes and child molesting?

Tell me what you think.

 

 

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current affairs, death, Iraq, Pluto, Syria, War

34 comments

Elizabeth Hathway said:

I don’t think it is possible to destroy the Islamic State – because for a start – it is not one organization. It is made up of lots of smaller groups all fighting their own more regional causes but under the ‘flag’ of the Islamic State because IS has money and can supply weapons. If the group that is not really a group at all, that we call IS breaks – say because of internal power struggles over leadership- then it will simply re-group or re-form somewhere else. Part of IS is an al Qaeda re-group. I think because the real troubles in the region will not have been addressed – whatever name the group calls itself is really irrelevant. Having said that … many thanks for sharing the chart 🙂

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Christina said:

One more interesting item on this chart is the Part of Fortune which is not shown here. It’s at 28° Sagittarius in the 12th house, a hidden source of income perhaps.

You’re right to point out that it’s a lot of different groups, but I think it’s coalescing and that is useful. The other side of that coin is the fractured nature of the alliance against Islamic State. The Turks & PKK hate each other, no one likes the Syrians, the Iranians are deeply suspicious of everyone, the Saudis have been funding IS all along etcetera etcetera.

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Jamie Partridge said:

Fascinating chart, certainly does look convincing.

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Christina said:

Thanks for stopping by Jamie

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Maureen Doran said:

I would normally think of Pluto in the 12th house as secret enemies but as it is so close to the Asc, I think it may be that they have a super power behind them and have been created to bring about a situation where the west will be held to ransom by having their oil supplies blocked? They are provoking the west to retaliate, attack them and draw them into their conflict. Why when this will only make things harder for them? Neptune in the 2nd in Pisces, seems to say they don’t actually have a tangible ideology? Sun in the 6th working for a higher power? Uranus in 3rd clearing / making space by creating sudden ruthless upheavals (taking no prisoners) in their environment ( where ever that is at the time) Mars 9th may represent the global response (air strikes) that they have provoked or even a global conflict? Scorpio MC, life and death other peoples resources and Saturn in 10th restricting lives, causing death and blocking others from their resources? Hopefully when Pluto comes over the Asc there will be some new joint world organisation to deal with all extremist groups? just my amateur interpretation,

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Christina said:

… and a good one. I find Pluto in the 12th in a mundane chart is all about secret power. Have a look at my chart for Egypt… It’s somewhere on this site.

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Randall G Collins said:

Islamic State [Cornelius]
Degree Interpretations by Elias Lonsdale
Assembled by Randall G Collins
September 26, 2014
Ascendant 13Cp07
CAPRICORN 14
Beads carved from human bone.
The body carries memories of every world we have ever been through. These memory strings or beads bind us to the Earth. We feel pinned to the spot, responsible for everything that happens around us–somehow the one in charge. For we are carrying the continuous memory and legacy of the ancient mystery-streams and of forgotten modes of knowledge. We bear the treasures intact. It makes everything count. It means that we cannot get away from ourselves or our fate for a moment; we are compelled to fulfill our vows and to bring into this world the towering awareness and strange resonance of the giants, of the ancestors, of the great ones, of the inner ways. Never lost; impossible to forget.
MC 4Sc14
SCORPIO 5
An Egyptian queen with a braided beard.
Bearing intact ancient faculties of an unusual kind. Held between polarities. Fusing together darkness and light, masculine and feminine, earthly and heavenly. An enigma or riddle of destiny. You are motivated to bring together what has been rent asunder by an implacable force of blind determination. Exceedingly resistant to distraction and diversion, you’re almost maniacally committed to reforging an initiate’s vision in contemporary application. Where the past is held with such undiminished force, it remains at work inside forever. To tap this place wisely and well requires consummate skill. Otherwise, it tends to be self-serious, obsessive-compulsive, and in many ways indigestible in its obdurate reassertion of ancient codes, with so little sensitivity to the human factor.
Sun 6Cn55
CANCER 7
The arctic wasteland under the setting sun.
Envisioning a way of life that is both utopian and practical. Dreaming of a very different mix in the sociocultural shared life. Motivated by the knowledge, the clear sensing, that all of this can be and must be. Wide open to the limitless Cosmos. Nominated or appointed to restore the total view. You are gifted exquisitely with an uncompromising truth sense that cleaves to what can be illuminated by the infinite, and you are most dramatically mobilized to spread this realization everywhere you go. Having known forever the way it really is, yet zealously drawn back into time to fertilize the ordinary landscape. All facets of life must partake of the bounty, and only then can we rest assured that we have done our part and followed the pulse of universal conscience where it naturally leads.
Moon 22Cn12
CANCER 23
A man putting together pieces of broken pottery.
Nothing works any more. The form of things is breaking apart. In your mind’s eye, you can remember how it once went, and you can certainly try to put it back together as it was. There is something about doing this that teaches you all kinds of things. And when you are called inside to reconstruct the old world and somehow keep it together one way or another, you must do it. One lesson you will eventually learn is how the mind works and why it is convinced that this task is so very necessary. But meanwhile, there is an elegance, sophistication, a cultured touch and sensibility that provides entry into so many fascinating worlds. Karmic recapitulation. Going back to the same places to do the same things can be quite a story to tell. Every bit of it is ebbing as it happens. All of your constructions in mind and outer form cannot hold on much longer. But the ego-mind is most tenacious and insistent in such destiny verges, hoping to postpone the deluge one more delicious moment.
Mercury 24Ge41Rx
GEMINI 25
A cave in deep ocean waters.
Stunning ways to preserve lost knowledge and lost worlds. The treasure chest is full to bursting. A leavening agent. A corrective to shallow patterns of existence. You are able to be so multidimensional that vastly divergent realities can be lived simultaneously and often are. Care and effort stand behind this place over myriad lifetimes. Contains boundless intact awareness held for the future. A contact point underneath conscious awareness. Faithful to the cause. Integrity above all.
Venus 6Ge10
GEMINI 7
A table comes to life and runs away.
The inner story is fanciful, full spectrum open, unformed. Outward events do not match the inner story. A question arises where to put the emphasis–what do you believe? If the way things go outwardly is all, the spirit is crushed. If caprice and whimsy contain treasures, there is room here for hope and for permission to be. But you cannot depend upon caprice and whimsy. So the battle rages between doubt and conviction. Doubt knows that it never works out as you planned. Conviction answers that it is entirely up to you and you will get what you asked for.
Mars 17Li27
LIBRA 18
A woman carefully counting the beans in a jar.
Taking outward phenomena literally. The utmost in naivete. You wander into every trap and pitfall with eyes wide open, wanting so badly for everything to add up and to make sense. Lacking a strong center of selfhood. Impressionable to recieved ideas and at the mercy of conditionings, wanting only to please and to make everybody happy, you are held within the circle of consensus agreement. Behaving in such exemplary fashion that it is too good to be true. All is from the outside in. Lessons in outlasting what you take on, and in showing up after being so far gone that nobody knew where to find you.
Jupiter 26Cn06
CANCER 27
A woman giving birth to twins.
Moving one way and moving another way at the same time, in the same breath, day in and day out. Inwardly compelled to take hold of given pairs of opposites and to work them by going into both and finding out how and where and why both cannot be refused, insist on being met. Captivated by your life predicament. Always seeing contradictory sides that in some ways cancel each other out. But also unfolding in multiple directions and truly born with a split karma. You have little choice but to cover all the bases, check everything out and play through each and every side of the situation. Consciously identifying with one thing at a time, but subconsciously absorbed in the other thing consistently. Prone to self-sabotage and searching for a lost path through which you can bring the polarities together, serve the whole, and yet be free within the serving and be unattached, just there to let it all come through, without making anything a burden or a self-blaming focus. The charge is removed when the opposites find each other again, and fanaticisms give way to the universal good met integrally.
Saturn 17Sc02Rx [Note: Due close proximity and Saturn Rx, I have shown both degrees]
SCORPIO 17
The mountain abode of a hermit.
A stronghold for secrets, hidden purposes, and inward streams to thrive and prevail. You live several lives in one, harboring the brightest, the darkest, the strangest, and the most wondrous worlds. Accustomed to the shadows and to meditation, prayer, and extraordinary discipline. Remaining in here forever. Absolutely uninvolved with surface affairs, no outer life whatsoever. But inwardly deep, intense, and overwhelmingly driven. Following through on ancient vows. A grim, heavy, somber tone. The capacity for root transformation and extraordinary realization. Your central focus is to be with God in the silence steadfastly, and there is nothing else that comes even close to feeling all the way through, on and true.
SCORPIO 18
People holding hands around a table. One candle is burning in the middle of the table.
Intimate depths of camaraderie. Forces joined by spirit call. Gathering in the name of a greater vision. Pooling resources, tapping what each does best, both inside the self and in soul links with others. Avid to combine forces. The drive to fuse. Passion, desire, intent, a surge of power. Being hugely drawn to consume separativeness and attain to unity and wholeness. A path or journey that will put you through every test and trial imaginable. Fierce resolve. And encountering shadows and dissipations so thunderous and multiplex that it will take everything it has inside to see this one through.
Uranus 16Ar17
ARIES 17
A bodiless head asleep on the beach.
Cast into exile, sworn to silence. Held to an ancient code to be a watcher, a perfect witness to the inward reverberations of all things. Outward events and experiences are gone, mean nothing here. All that counts is to sense into things, to remember the essence and to know the forgotten worlds. It is a lonely vigil, a strange destiny, with a piquant flavor of sorrow mixed with exultation. What others are happy with is far out of reach, unimaginable. Yet what so many others miss and are put off from is here vividly, vibrantly indwelled every moment, which sweetens the bitter cup and allows the greater task to be taken up with a surrendered will and a quiet, inward repose.
Neptune 7Pi30 Rx [Note: Due close proximity and Neptune Rx, I have shown both degrees]
PISCES 7
A candle burning. There is a ring of salt around it on the floor.
Spirit is well preserved from becoming untrue. It is held within its own matrix, and granted a pure and wonderfully veiled atmosphere and feeling tone and sphere to stay within. From this place spirit can empower itself to be whole, to commune, to remember, and to conceive. You are given what you need, and a specially-granted timing grace to be ushered through the world in a guided tour that leads only to the temples and the marvels that are here. However, all of this happens inside, deep inside. The outside situation may belie the inward experience. But here what seems in the moment is as nothing, and what is really there between the lines and through the cracks is everything. This is a domain set apart for special purposes, projects, and endeavors, and is the perfect retreat for one who wishes to remain in touch with the living spirit, who wishes never to forget what it is that stands under the phenomenal world and keeps the eternal flame burning without a flicker.
PISCES 8
A gypsy peasant woman sings a mournful chant.
The earth is broken. The compact between a human soul and her earth housing is violated. Some of us are sensitive to what has gone wrong and must proclaim a conscience-change. An agonizing place to be, and yet treated as just the way it is, met with huge resolve, almost welcoming that it has come down to this. Creatively expressive of what it feels like to be here in the midst, you feel resonant with all the kingdoms of nature, and especially aligned with the soul of this planet in her deep changes. Put in the right place at the right time to call the occasion, to make things unavoidable, you feel almost immobilized by how huge the task is. Yet you are stoical, dedicated, exceedingly strong, and enduring. Able to withstand the shaking-loose of the old Earth. In here for the duration. Just getting going when it all seems lost.
Pluto 12Cp25Rx [Note: Due close proximity and Pluto Rx, I have shown both degrees]
CAPRICORN 12
A beautiful, erotic fat woman eating chocolates.
Obsession with images of what is desirable and undesirable. Polarization of the inward awareness between plus and minus. The extreme reliance upon external proof, external props, and external projection. Everything blown up to be so dramatic, so total, and so pressurized that what comes forth is the inversion of what is sought. Placing yourself in predicaments and dilemmas which are impossible and gross. Yet being stalwartly resistant to getting the message that when you persist in polarizing your world between the absolute ideal and the abysmal norm, you tear apart your world and your being.
CAPRICORN 13
A very old wrinkled brown paper sack.
Use and misuse. Taking advantage of your own beast of burden endurance to get the most out of yourself you possibly can. Extracting productive results from all other factors and fixating upon these. Eventually you get what you put into it. And if there is a self-exploitative or a darkly-abusive side to your way of operating, it generates the karma of aging and death and blight. It becomes crucial to develop, against the grain, compassion and all the gentler feelings. Because if unchecked, the heavy-handed self-demand to make the world work better at all costs will decimate the inner self.
Moon’s Node North 25Li34Rx [Note: Due close proximity and North Node Rx, I have shown both degrees]
LIBRA 25
In the midst of a forest, a great circular open area.
In Celtic lands, steeped in a power beyond the world, there were openings always into other times and places, from within this time and place. Discovering once again these passages, and sending an expanded part of your self to explore and inhabit all of the times and places officially denied. And being therefore given to a harkening to the unknown, and to the sensibility of simultaneously feeling linked up with just about everybody everywhere in a mystical, magical realization that pulls you along and calls one to become free and true, you walk onward into the limitless ways as though you had never lost them and no time had elapsed between great inward breaths.
LIBRA 26
A gypsy cart with a campfire nearby.
Magical ways of life are just about gone and are returning from a completely different side. The instinctual attunement to nature and to God is being trampled under. But the reclaimed, more advanced instincts, after individuality had gone as far as it could go, are becoming the conscience pulse of the planet in a more futuristic way. Wandering from pre-individual states through the maze of individuality into post-individual states–in midstream it is trying to pass as a fully individuated creature. But it is profoundly unstirred by the separative ego fireworks and just waiting for the next evolutionary move to sweep all of it away. Timelessly, inwardly witnessing the passing of worlds. And waiting expectantly for the time when people move out beyond themselves, and discover Cosmos and Earth as one and live in that place as though it never had been lost and the world had never turned against itself.
Moon’s Node South Rx 25Ar34Rx [Note: Due close proximity and south Node Rx, I have shown both degrees]
ARIES 25
A great dragon asleep in a cave.
Storing up for centuries all of the best goodies for the time when they are needed, meanwhile, you are cast loose between source and destination, buffeted by strange winds and held firmly between the ancient past and the near future. Karmically held in the balance. Truly having nothing to do until waiting is fulfilled. But where there is nothing to do, mischief and mayhem proliferate. You participate in karmic scenarios, elaborate dramatizations, variations on the theme of nobody home and nothing happening yet. Supremely restless while deeply restful. If there should come a time when all the signal flares go off and give the go ahead, your stored up power and resources shall prove to be absolutely incredible. From way back when to the promised time, you feel a projectile of intent to hold on no matter what. In a cross between a crazy deal and the purest vows of commitment not to push the river and to wait for the universal waters to flood their banks and bring you back alive, right on time for futures unlimited.
ARIES 26
The man in the moon smiling.
Living on the edge. Poised at many brinks. Swept up in a tide of changes–chaotic and magnificent. Everywhere at once, you are creative and generative, overwhelmed and overstimulated, but primarily exulting in yourself and your emergent capacities. Falling in love with the dance of destiny you find yourself in. Ecstatic release in being able to catch the spark as it flies. Very fast, very strong, very remarkable, and knowing it.
Part of Fortune 27Sg50
SAGITTARIUS 28
A witch’s ritual dagger.
Strong, focused intent to create and stay with your own world within the world. Being flooded by collective contents and then strategically carving out a distinctive way of being with an emphasis upon eccentricity and maverick ways. Being impelled to generate tenuous yet firm boundaries to give any hope at all of continuity and consistency. You are at an advanced and intricate crossroads in development, where you are inwardly blown wide open and outwardly desperate to forge individuality and personal life. The cosmos inundates the landscape. And the one inside the body makes endless small gestures to constitute an island reality that fools nobody and only momentarily keeps the floodtide at bay.

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Christina said:

Thank you for this. I am going to read it carefully now, but it would be wonderful to illustrate this and publish it as a post.

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Maureen Doran said:

I can imagine the illustrations, they would be lovely…..xx

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Christina said:

Tonight, I asked by 9 year old which religious story she’d enjoyed studying the most so far.
“Kali,” she replied promptly. “I like the thuggee.” She likes to shock.
But it does occur to me that Islamic State is a thuggee-style outfit. The thuggee were, of course, assassins, who sacrificed travellers to Kali. It’s where we get the word thug from. Think Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom.

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Erin said:

Will be interesting to see what comes up when Pluto gets back to this degree.

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Christina said:

Yes.

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PM said:

Uh, yeah, kids can have unexpected reasons to like stuff ;).

Anyway, the more I look at this chart, the more it tells a really really nasty, dystopic story. Actually, dis-eased seems more appropriate.

1) Two a**holes congratulating each other: The chart ruler (Saturn) and its dispositor (Pluto) are locked in a toxic co-dependent stew.
Saturn in Scorpio in particular is supposed to be an ‘evil’ position in traditional astrology, I think.
Also, while they are not strictly in a sextile, given the mutual reception, I would say Pluto and Saturn are talking so much to each other, that they might as well be aspected.

2) So many retrogrades!: Turning inward is one interpretation of Rx. Isn’t twisting the message another one? Because that would really fit this chart. 5 retrograde planets, 1 retrograde point (okay 2, for two nodes). Highest point in the chart is retrograde. So is the chart ruler. So are two out of three outer planets.

3) When you’re feeling sad, lash out like a whacko: Sometimes, following the rulers of each house results in a story so literal, it’s scary. Here we go, then:
Soothe your pain (Chiron) with something irrational (Neptune). But what kind of irrational? Well, the planets may be in Pisces, but with Aquarius on the cusp = Uranus is the ruler of the second house. Who sits in Aries, with Mars as the ruler. Meaning: you’re in pain, and you can’t figure it out (thanks in part to Neptune) so pull some crazy violent s**t,

4) Be afraid of the female of the species: Uranus is trine Lilith. how are the female members of IS being treated, I wonder? I imagine they are scary as hell. Lilith is also square Saturn: this could also be an indication of rape: rape as a means of punishment (Saturn) and fear (also Saturn). I bring Lilith in since you mentioned her in the Delhi rape chart, Christina (sorry, what a horrible reference to make 🙁 ). Nevertheless, the woman who is an outsider is being heavily punished.

5. The people vs. the master: That Moon trine Saturn aspect: oh boy. You could write a whole post about that aspect alone.

6. Saturn and Pluto vs. the Moon: People (Moon) poured their feelings (Moon in Cancer) into an inflexible system (Saturn) and ended up with nasty, secretive tyrants (Saturn in Scorpio and Pluto in Capricorn in mutual reception).

7. The Moon is on the receiving end of a lot of crap, including from Uranus, of course. The moon is stuck (fleeing to a refugee camp is not escape; this is a continuing, ongoing nightmare for the various peoples).

8. Twisted messages, bad signals: What is the truth in all the awfulness being reported about ISIS? With a retrograde Mercury in Gemini, the sign of liars, who knows? This could also be indicative of the effectiveness of IS’ online propaganda, which appears to be unconnected to its financial funding (Pluto) or to its original structure (Saturn). Which is really scary. Ideas unconnected to structure or to morality (Jupiter) but which influence action (Uranus opposition Mars) – oh. my. god. I’m making this last conclusion not from a reading of a single aspect, but including what two seperate aspects can mean together (whole greater than sum of parts and all that).

9. An uneasy peace: Well, the North Node *is* in Libra. There’s always hope that tortuous negotiation will bring some kind of peace….. right??

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Christina said:

Wow. Thanks P. Really great analysis.
Re 4) Yes, I heard an interview with a resident of Raqqah who said that the number of women volunteers from abroad has doubled in the past few months and they are scary. There are also reports — which may not be true — that ISIL women are organising the slave brothels.
Re 8) I think the effectiveness of the online propaganda is fascinating. Stupid and violent for the stupid and violent, I guess, but it works. Apparently recruits are streaming across the Turkish border.

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Christina said:

I just got this email about this chart, so you may want to adjust accordingly. I wonder if I read my handwriting correctly.

Hi Christina,

I shared your post on ISIS – re: the Cornelius data. It got quite some reactions in the FB mundane astrologers group – including a few from two other astrologers who were also at the Cornelius lecture in Oxford. They had noted different data:

Cornelius at the AA Conference in UK

29 June 2014, time 7.39.50 pm Bat -3.00 local time = 4:39:50 pm UTC, Place Ar-Raqqah Syria – 35N56 039E01

Asc 07.52 Capricorn Moon 03.57 Leo . On this chart the Sun is on the Desc.

For myself I have a chart for 7:34: pm local time, which is 4:34 pm UTC. The time starting Ramadan for Ar-Raqqah is at 7:45 pm local time.

I thought you might be interested to know.

My best,

Elizabeth Hathway

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Eleonora said:

@PM Talking about women: Mars squere moon can be an indication of misogyny. Or of the civil war of course and army tyrinnizing people.

Mars squere jupiter is intriguing, though. These hard jupiter – mars aspects often indicate some conflicts with religious authorities. And sometimes the frustrations about the way of generating the money and welth. Jupiter – moon conjunction on DC: IS has wealthy partners, IS has extremely wealthy partners and sponsors – but it despises them. Just think about the golf states, about the Saudis, and their relationship with IS. The lilith in th 7th: Partners and enemys fear them. Yet, they are viciously fascinated as well.

You are right about N. Node in libra. However, the S. Node is in aries and I don’t see any hope for traveling towards N. Node soon. And then, N. Node widely conjunct mars. There will be no negotiations. IS has to be destroyed military. Not till then, the peace will be an option.

And about progressing pluto… IS will transform wenn pluto enters the 1st house… for better or worse.

But not the pluto in 12th is their most dangerous weapon. It’s the N. node in 9th together with the jupiter-moon conjunction, the religious fanatism spreading all over the world, and it trines the “devil” in the 10th. Take a look at Hitlers chart again.

Thank you for the chart and the discussion, Christina!

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PM said:

That’s what I mean: it’s an uneasy peace, with a constant threat of war.

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Isy said:

Has anyone noted the grand trine between Saturn, Chiron and the Moon? It’s like rape and torture are normalized. The people are in for it.

Also noticed Pluto points a finger each at the Sun and Moon from the 12th. Talk about remote control.

This chart is truly shocking. I jumped when I saw it, and it took awhile (and reading your article) to realize why.

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Christina said:

Yes & now we have the second chart, I still feel that Pluto on the ASC and Scorpio on the MC must be right. I’ve been pondering this all day.

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Paula said:

I’d also point out the south node is conj Eris. It’s like an opened pandora’s box of all the ugliness and hate humanity is still capable of, has been unleashed. I also view the south node as an incarnating and manifesting energy.

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PM said:

That’s a big lot of ugly right there.

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el_ka said:

Hi Christina
While doing some research on I.S. I came across your blog here, showing Cornelius’ chart (and the revised chart elsewhere on your blog). But I need to point out that this one *is* the correct Cornelius’ chart, also used by a Skyscript forum member:

“Geoffrey Cornelius said it was clear from the announcement of the founding of the Islamic State that its founding was to coincide with the start of Ramadan at Ar-Raqqah in Syria….. The start of Ramadan (like any new month in the Islamic calendar) is indicated by the first sighting of the new Moon, which was as the Sun set on Saturday 28th of June. The new Moon would not have been visible until the Sun was about 6 degrees below the horizon, so this gives the time for setting the chart, which is about 17:05 UTC”

The chart is now on: http://www.astro.com/astro-databank/Islamic_State_(Caliphate)

Regards, El

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Christina said:

Thanks Elka. This discussion was a while ago. This chart certainly looks right, but honestly with all the discussion around it, I won’t feel entirely comfortable until I work it out from scratch myself.

I spoke to a Middle East journalist about the date and place and he said that the date is certainly right, but the place is iffy. It could actually be one of several town in northern Syria. I would say that you can tell this is the right time by the position of the moon just above the horizon.
I put both up because some people got quite shirty with me & I wasn’t sure of my handwritten notes.

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Niru said:

I looked at the vedic chart. The ascendant if Sagittarius with pluto in it. Shows the religious obsessive character of the organization. Jupiter is exalted and vargottama in the 8th house, and the ascendant is also vargottama – gives a very determined stubborn character to the organization. But Jupiter in the 8th gives a taste for addiction, excitement, violence. I have the chart of a woman with the same ascendant and Jupiter in the 8th. She is just now recovering from drug addiction.

The other interesting thing about the chart is the vargottama position of Rahu (North node) another indicator for drugs, illusions. This is conjunct an exalted saturn which is debilitated in navamsa. So while there seems to be a kind of discipline involved with masses, this breaks down and will not stand. Both rahu and saturn stand for the 3rd house of arms. The weakness of the group may not be in numbers but in discipline and facing hardships.

Looking at the 7th house of open enemies and 6th house illhealth etc – both are strong with 6th lord venus vargottama and 7th lord mercury vargottama and retrograde, together with sun as 9th lord. There is a raja yoga in the 7th house of open enemies, which makes me think that this is the nazi movement repeated all over again. Initial success, mass followers and allies followed by a crumbling when opposition gets tough. They will face opposition from the Islamic world as well, as venus represents islam in the 6th house – the Islamic world will end up policing them. 2021 may be a big turning point when saturn becomes the key energy. This aspects the ascendant and it’s ruler as well and will cause a crisis of confidence. A saturn that seems strong but is internally weak has no staying power. At the present the energy of Jupiter prevails and Jupiter is strong in transit as well until later this year. Things would change then as well.

The interesting thing is that the open enemy will use the media against them to good effect – this will be the most effective strategy. With the owner of the 8th house joining the 7th, I would think that in some way, the “landlords” of ISIS will side with the open opposition and this will weaken them. In this case, I would think they would be the people whose countries ISIS is occupying or their leaders. Not sure. We live in interesting times.

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Christina said:

Thanks for this Niru. “The weakness of the group may not be in numbers but in discipline and facing hardships.” That seems very likely. “Initial success, mass followers and allies followed by a crumbling when opposition gets tough.” I hope they are defeated before 2021. The stories coming Yazidi refugees last week were really heart-wrenching.

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Gray said:

astrodatabank is quoting this page. Yet the chart I created back in Jun 2014 is Jun 29. The wikipedia page https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_State_of_Iraq_and_the_Levant says “Declaration of caliphate: 29 June 2014”. I couldn’t isolate the tweet I believed to be the declaration(yes, a tweet is how they did it). My forum postings I have saved from Jun 30. I tracked down an initial burst of tweets using several keywords, and made something of the time, so there is no official time I could locate. I saved the chart at 15:18 GMT jun 19 Ar Raqqah

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Christina said:

Yes, I sought further clarification on this and I wrote to Professor Cornelius for clarification on his reasoning and the definitive chart. Here is the post I wrote about this http://www.oxfordastrologer.com/2015/03/definitive-chart-for-isis.html.

That chart is for June 29, 19.39.50, Ar-Raqqah, Syria.

Astrodatabank never got in touch with me about this! Thanks for telling me.

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Gray said:

Woops, I see I typoed too, telling you what chart I saved. 19?lol. Great. I’ll just prompt them. Easy. ADB should resource that given what i understand of their operations. here’s my thread of me tracking it down btw http://forum.astro.com/cgi/forum.cgi?num=1404163173/9#9 The Janduz symbol I quote in that thread is oringinally in Sepharial 2 degrees earlier… interesting. Sepharial: 4-5 Libra — A red triangle. Janduz 6-7 Libra — “A raptor, with blood dripping from its claws, flies in front of a triangle of fire which seems to be hung between heaven and earth.”

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Christina said:

My hair is standing on end.

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Andries H. Cats said:

From Skyscript forum:

Tweet Announcement
Another approach was to time the start of the Caliphate from a release of a tweet on June 29th (Presumably from from Ar-Raqqah, Syria). Two different times have subsequently emerged of 12:05AM, CDT, USA provided by the astrologer Peter Novak and 8.05AM BST, UK, provided by Nathan Strange. Contrary to what Peter Novak initially assumed tweets record the time the message is received in the local time of the recipient not the time of the sender!

Using Peter Novak’s time we arrive at a local time in Syria of 08:05am. While Nathan suggested the time of his tweet had to be 05:05AM.

Working with Peter Novak’s time we see CDT is 5 hours behind GMT and 8 hours behind local time in Syria. So this suggests a local time of 08:05AM for the tweet being sent. In contrast Nathan Strange states his tweet is recorded as 08:05AM BST (British Summer time ie GMT+1 hour). From this time he has subtracted 3 hours to get a local time of 5:05AM in Syria for the tweet. However, later in the thread I have disputed this derived time. My point is that Syria is 3 hours ahead of GMT not behind. I suggest this indicates a local time in Syria of 10:05AM not 5:05AM as Nathan has suggested.
Hi Nathan,

Gosh this whole timing issue for the Caliphate must be at the top of my list for most frustrating topic ever here!

So just to clarify you believe Peter Novak was assuming the feed gave him local time from the sender. But you think it actually records the time of the receiver based on their time settings?

Assuming your right about that Nathan doesn’t that make your originally proposed time of 2:05 GMT somewhat questionable?

Even with daylight assisted time the central USA would be at least 5 hours behind GMT. So the local time Syria would be more like 08:05AM no?

However, I checked and Peter Novak is in Indiana. Its one of those really frustrating states that comes under both Eastern Standard and Central Time Zone!

http://www.timetemperature.com/tzus/indiana_time_zone.shtml

However, the vast majority of the state is EST. And they have daylight saying just now. So I assume his time was GMT-4. This would time his tweet to 4:05 AM GMT.

That being the case Syrian local time is currently GMT+3

So I would assume a local time of 7:05AM Syria based on that not 5:05?.

Incidentally, your comment above on 08:05am (BST or GMT?) doesn’t make sense to me. Was this a mistake? As you know Syrian local time is 3 hours ahead of GMT just now.

Mark

End of Skyscript story.

I set the time 7:05 AM Syria to 7 AM and rectified it as 6.59.13 hours.

Mars ruler MC 18 Libra opposite MC 18 Aries.

Progressive rectifying aspect:

5-Jul-2014 016°,17’55 Aries MC 0 Ura

Transits:

5-Jul-2014 013°,11’11 Cancer Sun 0 ZwZn
5-Jul-2014 -20°,16’54 Plu # Asc
5-Jul-2014 014°,59’52 Libra Moon 60 Black Moon
5-Jul-2014 027°,38’58 Cancer Jup 0 Moon ruler Ascendant
25 October 2014 = islamic New Year.
25-Oct-2014 022°,21’59 Taurus C-11 45 Sun
25-Oct-2014 019°,39’00 Leo Jup 0 Pars transit
25-Oct-2014 029°,22’01 Sagittarius Mars 150 Asc transit

15 October 2015 = Islamitic New Year.
15-Oct-2015 002°,20’26 Sagittarius Sat 135 MC transit
15-Oct-2015 012°,38’58 Virgo Mars 45 Moon transit
15-Oct-2015 012°,24’57 Virgo Mars 120 Plu transit

Islamic state ruler Ascendant the Moon 28 Cancer is square Pluto the USA 28 Capricornus also ruler of the Ascendant.

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Andries H. Cats said:

Rectification.

28 Cancer is opposite 28 Capricornus.

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Christina said:

Thanks for this Andries and I have to agree with the comment — the most frustrating ever?!

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Michael Gintowt said:

I was interested to note that the ascendant is about the same degree for the chart of the opening of the COP21 Climate change talks in Paris. Certainly, the presence of ISIS, in the form of reverberations from the terror attacks, is part of the context.

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