Lilith, the Rebel Soul: “Drink Stars And Ask For The Moon”

September 5, 2013

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I was looking for the will of the wild. I was looking for how that will expressed itself in elemental vitality, in savage grace. Wildness is resolute for life: it cannot be otherwise; for it will die in captivity. It is elemental: pure freedom, pure passion, pure hunger. It is its own manifesto…

“…I wanted to live at the edge of the imperative, in the tender fury of the reckless moment, for in this brief and pointillist life, bright-dark and electric, I could do nothing else. By laying the line of my way along another, older path, I would lay my passions where they belonged, flush with wildness…

“… I would only know my deepest glee if I could dive into an ocean full of trilling fish. I wanted to climb mountains until I cracked with the same ancient telluric vigour that flung the Himalayas up to applaud the sky. I was, in fact, homesick for wildness, and when I found it I knew how intimately — how resonantly — I belonged there. We are charged with this. All of us. For the human spirit has a primal allegiance to wildness, to really live it, to snatch the fruit and suck it, to spill the juice. We may think we are domesticated but we are not…. 

“… wildness is flagrantly sexual – the longest passion of all species, the longing of daffodils for the spring sun, the thirsting of all roots for water, the sensual relationship between humanity and nature, humming with it, earthy to the core.

“To me, humanity is not a stain on wilderness…Rather human nature is one of the most striking realisations of wildness. It is as eccentrically beautiful as an ice crystal, as liquidly life-generous as water, as inspired as air. Kerneled up within us all, an intimate wildness, sweet as a nut. For the rebel soul in everyone then, the right to wear feathers, drink stars and ask for the moon.

From the introduction to Wild: An Elemental Journey by Jay Griffiths

Kerneled up within us all, Lilith, the Dark Moon, yearning for expression, yearning to re-connect us with wildness and to our own wild nature.

I am always looking for Lilith, the most misunderstood part of the natal chart, digging around to get to the truth of her. I have written about her in the past — in the charts of writers, feminists and Joan Crawford. My colleague, Michael Wolfstar, has found her strong in the charts of comedians.

Lilith is our wildness, our savage mind. In your natal chart she is the black sickle. Where she is and what she aspects will show where you are at your most elemental, most pure. Lilith is not “good” or “bad” in the same way that a mountain or a forest is not good or bad. She simply is.

So much of our “civilised” culture is expended in suppressing and attacking Lilith: Satan, circumcision, deforestation. Civilisations is set up as the opposite of wildness, so that wildness defines civilisation by being the other.

The same is true in the natal chart. Civilisation is at its most obvious as Saturn, the keeper of time, the maker of walls and rules. What is the relationship between Lilith and Saturn in your chart? Lilith time is not the same as the time of clocks and watches, school bells and the news on the hour. When you are with Lilith, you are in the unfolding, spiral time of nature.

This book came into my hands last week: Lilith is trining my Sun. I  opened it and found her voice.

Books, Lilith

51 comments

Anonymous said:

Natal Lilith conjuncts the MC in my chart. I have wild hair that refuses to be tamed, equally exuberant eyebrows that I only sometimes groom, and I love to go out wildcrafting herbs. Someone once observed me on one of my expeditions and referred to me as a “cavewoman.” I took it as a compliment!

With Virgo rising and a very proper Capricorn Sun, my life would be so dull without lovely Lilith.

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Christina said:

Hee hee.

I have Lilith simmering just beneath the desc – sometimes scary.

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Anonymous said:

Oh wow, you are prescient … I’ve been trying to learn more about Lilith …
My BMLilith is in Cap in the 12th (conj my Asc), sextile my Pisces Sun … together they make a yod to Saturn in Leo in the 7th …
Relationships are tricky because Lilith just won’t let me be anything but free!
– Janonymous

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P said:

Lilith at 0 Capricorn, conjunct Juno at 1 Capricorn, sextile Jupiter at 0 Scorpio.

Future husbands should perhaps note that when I get angry, I’ll get very angry 😀

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Anonymous said:

HA!
I don’t always show anger, but bad fortune sometimes has a way of following those who wrong me. Am surprised my ex-husband isn’t covered in boils.

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Anonymous said:

Che Brava! Christina, this is the best portrayal of the Lilith I have ever come across! So radically different, before, I could never look at Lilith in the chart comfortably. Now I understand why people look at Lilith as causing troubles.

Such amazing and, of course natural interpretation.

Mine is in 0 Pisces 1st. I understand my pull towards oceans. Any time I am in troubles, I end up somewhere near the water. My wet dream is to live right at the seaside. Hopefully no men around.

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Christina said:

Thank you. I’ve always been uncomfortable with the “femme fatale” reading of her & when I looked a some real life femme fatale charts – e.g. the Duchess of Windsor – she was not there at all. She is much more interesting than a male fantasy.

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Anonymous said:

my lilith…pluto sitting on it currently, as it opposes my moon and squares my venus, i am always by the water`s edge, my pisces o2 sun, neptune 0 scorpio… oh yes , i am living a wet dream.

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Ellie said:

I like this description Christina “Lilith is not “good” or “bad” in the same way that a mountain or a forest is not good or bad. She simply is.” So many astrology articles have stigmatised lilith as being this forbidden angst ridden part of ourselves.

I have lilith quite strong in my chart. She’s conjunct my venus/mars conjunction at 19/20 aries in the 10th house, trine uranus in the 6th. I’m very ambitious and energetic, career is my life (I put that down to mars/venus aries in 10th).

But I can definitely relate to the “cavewoman” description referenced above by anonymous. I’ve never been into the idea of being swept away by a knight in shining armour. No, my ideal is the caveman type who’ll drag me by the hair into his cave 🙂 Eek, should I have said that?!

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Christina said:

That is a supercharged Lilith indeed – very sexy, powerful life force. You’d need someone powerful to match you. I am still reading Wild and wondering if the author has lashings of Aries as a matter of fact.

I think she’s got the Lilith in Capricorn – 1965 could be Cap or Aq.

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Anonymous said:

Hi Christina! O this Lillith is the best explanation for me! What is my attachment to wild? I can’t help it! I put people off sometimes, this interp helps so much. Lillith conjuncts MC Sag exact, trine ARies Sun, opp Gemini Moon on IC, she aspects venus, Jupiter and etc! and I have worked years and YEARS to incorporate the theme of wildness in my work. I’m an artist and a teacher of art. How do you relate Lillith as an aspect of the Great Goddess, say the neolithic one of Marija Gimbutas? Does that make sense? Wildness is so imperative for me that I connect more with wildness than I do with men! And I love men! AArgh! So frustrating! So relieved and glad you found this Lillith and shared! Thank you!

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Christina said:

I am just getting my head around you chart set up – blimey. Lilith is the queen of your chart is she not, opposite the Moon there. I think Sag is also one of the signs that connects most obviously with the wild – a centaur, half man-half beast. With a chart like that, you might be a kind of conduit for Lilith. Aries can channel energy straight down from the divine sometimes.

I think she is an aspect of the Great Goddess, definitely. You can see her also in the local goddesses that Gimubutas writes about – the bee goddess, the mistress of wild animals, diana. But I am not sure Lilith is always female. I see the Wild Man and the Green Man as expressions of Lilith, Jung’s animus also. And I think we all have the Wild Man inside us, as well as the Wild Woman.

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Diana Sanchez Ponce said:

Reading about Lilith to understand myself better. It gave me chills what you wrote. I know this is from 2013 but I wanted to tell you.
My name is Diana and I have Lilith rising. (Asc 25″ Virgo conj Lilith 0″ Libra).

Thanks for all your posts about Lilith!

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Christina said:

Astrology works!

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Christina said:

On a whim I just looked up Starhawk’s birthchart. She has Lilith right on the MC like you. It’s in gemini – communication, teaching – and about 3° from her Sun also on the MC….

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Anonymous said:

This is glorious, so deliciously sensuous. Thanks Christina. Yes, this is it, the wild self. She is in Aq in 12h, conj Pallas and a bit wider, Juno. They sq Nep in 9h Scorpio and are exactly inconj Plu/U in 7h Virgo. There’s a minor asp with Sat in 1h pisces but maybe as that opposes the Plu/U and due to all the Neptune, I feel it strongly. I find her hard to see directly. At the same time I feel like I see too much; there’s too much information coming in to manage in a relationship. If that makes sense. Music and nature are important outlets, otherwise she’s mostly blocked in expression but oh my goodness my internal life. My dreams are wild.

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Christina said:

Yes, I have an Aquarian Lilith too – which is quite a strange place to have her, since Aquarius is such a civilised sign. It’s like we have our wild wood in the middle of town, especially with Pallas there which is such an organising and intelligent energy.

When you know something is blocked, that in itself is quite interesting. You can see how easily she flows for some people from some of the responses to this piece and the other Lilith posts, but I think the Aquarian placement is hard. However, the 12th house/Neptune stuff is the key for you, isn’t it? She’s there talking to you in dreams, but like I said in my previous answer, I think Lilith is often expressed as a Wild Man. In our dreams she can figure as an animus type figure.

We are so inured to the male POV within our culture that we forget about how the “other” is often expressed as a woman -eg the femme fatale, the Lilith, vagina dentata – because she is written about by men, whereas for women, this other, this deep inner wildness can be quite masculine.

Personally, I think Lilith manifests as both for me, but I am still mulling this one over.

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Anonymous said:

Yes you express something essential there for me too about the masculine. Or maybe the energy feels beyond masculine and feminine, just pure life force. But needs to be expressed through our cultural constructs which is where the twistiness happens; I can’t easily reconcile that energy with my internalised ideas about being a woman.
Christina, do you feel a book about astrological Lilith coming on? You write about her beautifully and there’s not a lot out there.

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Anonymous said:

how do you find your lilith I. your chart? I do have my chart so I should be able to find it on my own?!

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Christina said:

The symbol for Lilith is a black sickle shape. It’s not necessarily on your chart. If you don’t see, go to astro.com, extended horoscope selection and type in your details. There’s a box on the bottom left which allows you to add Lilith to your chart – along with a host of other objects.

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Anonymous said:

thank you so much! I love the comments and beautiful interaction of ideas on your blog.

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Anonymous said:

I have lilith in 1st house gemini moon and Saturn in virgo and sun Neptune in sag in 7th . what kind of placement is that?

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Christina said:

It’s about relationships, mirroring and imagination for you. Do other people find you wild? It’s also about art and communication. More I can’t say, except that your Saturn placement keeps you rooted into the earth and without it, you might be very floaty.

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Anonymous said:

Thank you for this, it makes so much more sense than other interpretations I’ve read.

My Lilith is in Scorpio tucked in my 12th house behind my Scorp asc and conjunct my Mars/Neptune conjunction there and guess what, I love WILD swimming… especially in the sea. I have little fear of depths (maybe a bit, but also find them thrilling) and love to swim out as far as I can, mindful of the fact that I need to get back! My partner is a Pisces – she loves to look at the sea, I have an irresitible urge to get IN it.

The only other time anyone might know in public about my wild side is when I’m dancing, I think Mars/Neptune loves, needs, to dance. What goes on in private is another matter, but even then it’s mine to share if I want, or not!

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Anonymous said:

I am not really sure the book you quote is getting at, or whether you have it right, or the author has it right. It seems from my perspective dangerous to say the least. What comes to mind is fritz perls and his ‘you be yourself and I will be myself. Should we meet and get on then fine. But should we meet and not got along, then you go yourway and I will go mine’. Be yourself – warts and all theory. Mind you his perspective was heavily influenced by being in a nazi concentration camp.

I have met people who are a little rougher at the edges and do their own thing. They are not nice people. I am sure you or the author would not like them. The sex, drugs and rock’n’roll type and the hangers on and those who would like to be like that.

FTR – my lilith is 5 degrees of sagg – t-squaring uranus at 7 virgo and mars/sun at 6/8 degres pisces respectivily.

I moved to where I am when pluto by transit was at 5 sagg, and as I have written before the people here say what they want, where they want, to who they want, when they want.

Its not pleasant living with the “wild ones” in the “wild west”.

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Christina said:

This really is not about the wild west, or “sex and drugs and rock n roll” or rugged individualism. It’s about our relationship with nature.

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Anonymous said:

wow! That’s pretty spot on! yes people do see me as very wild even though that rootedness is there keeing it in check! but when it’s unleashed it’s hard to put in words.. it’s hard to contain. and there is very strong artistic drive there, and I can dance all night!

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Anonymous said:

I have Lilith in Leo in my 7th house: Quincunx Sun and Juno, Opposition Venus, Trine Jupiter, Square Pluto, and conjunct Vertex. 🙂 Not sure what it all means but hopefully more will be written about Lilith and her placements and aspects!

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Christina said:

And start with the tightest aspect there; otherwise it can get quite confusing. So the opposition to Venus could be the key aspect but it really depends on which is closer.

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Caroline said:

I have Lilith in Gemini, in my 9th house, opposing Saturn in Sag. The see-saw between wildness and, well, Saturn! It can feel muted at times, subconscious. Limited wildness. I feel sort of like Saturn in Sag reiterates the opposition itself.

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Christina said:

I see what you mean.

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Caroline said:

Oops, Lilith in the 8th house I meant.

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Anonymous said:

That book looks really interesting. My Lilith is in Pisces fifth. I never wanted children although I like kids. I love to get to the coast when I can and will swim practically in any natural water spot and constantly dream of trying to get to the beach. I have never been a femme fatale and value my independence above all house and live by myself in a fairly wild place which I love.

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Jules and Gil said:

Christina, could you put that link up again to the witchy woman singing about Herne? It was great but I can’t find it x

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Jassi J said:

Lilith’s catch phrase is ‘I’m back!’
Taken from another Astrologer I recently read describing Lilith and how we suffer when we block her pure life force expression. It really made me wanting to hear the classic song from Thin Lizzy, 1975, ‘Wild One’.

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Anonymous said:

Brilliant! I’ve always wondered why others see me as ‘mad’ or ‘crazy’ (but in a good way) and why people who hardly know me always say ‘here comes trouble’…I have Lilith conj. Asc in pisces, that’s why! All my life I’ve tried to do ‘normal’ and ‘behave’, Saturn and Chiron is also conj. I’ve literally got her under my skin and repressing her is madness but it has taken a long time (Saturn) and lots of mirroring from others to accept her call of the wild (Mars + Uranus/Pluto conj. dsc). Lilith also trines Scorpio sun in 8th and guess if I secretly know her voice too! Lilith will speak and act through me with or without my permission and sometimes others get scared and have to leave, but many like to see a Lilith in action because they don’t dare express her themselves. To dance with your inner Lilith takes guts and others will always see you as a bit nuts when you do, and isn’t this what we all learn with time, not to care too much what others say and to follow your inner voice? I must confess having Saturn tagging Lilith is a drag! But that’s what my stars say so there must be a lesson in there somewhere.The song ‘Human’ by The Killers came to mind where they ask if we are human or dancers, why can’t we be both? By the way, how often does Lilith go retrograde? And could you say something about that.

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Christina said:

Oh yes – that sounds Lilithish. I wonder though if Saturn might not be quite useful for you in that position. It means that you can let the Lilith out, but not be overwhelmed by that energy.

I used to live in London and there was this woman – maybe in her 30s, it was hard to tell – who wandered around my neighbourhood. She looked reasonably well off and she would walk the streets wrapped in layers of dirty clothing, coloured scarves and jumpers and baggy pants. She had a huge mane of salt and pepper hair that framed her face. Anyway every now and then she would stop in front of the plate glass window of a posh restaurant and do a really crazy dance, making faces at the shiny people with their delicate forks and new clothes.

That was a bit of a digression. Lilith shouldn’t go retrograde, since she’s a mathematical point really. Here’s a definition — http://www.astro.com/astrology/in_lilith_e.htm — with a diagram.

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Jassi J said:

Christina, can you please give me glimpse in how to interpret the square in my natal chart between the Sun in Leo 12th House 24 degrees and Lilith in Taurus 9th House 24 degrees. You might have noticed this aspect awhile ago when you read my chart, it just came to my attention since you posted the Lilith article.

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Allan said:

Lilith 2 Taurus 8th, Pluto 2 Scorpio 2nd, Neptune 2 Capricorn 4th, Moon 5 Virgo 12th, Sun 2 Cancer 10th…

I’m fiercely independent and in touch with my 5 senses. I dance and sing alot 🙂 Even tho I am tone-def…I don’t mind. I’ve always felt a connection to Lakshmi, if that counts lol Shes my FAV Goddess. I got huge respect for Ceres. Enjoy the fact that she broke the law of death and proved to the world that there is indeed life after death, when her daughter returned from the underworld.

You gotta stand up for what you believe in. To have lost and not accept, yet to get everything back like nothing was lost in the first place…THAT’S DEDICATION! Gotta play fire with fire 😉

MAN I attract some of the MOST aggressive…BULL-DIKE woman ever…That feel compelled to protect me. LoL I tease the feminist cause ALL you woman know this fellow isn’t the slightest bit interested in you all! Not my cup of tea. I’m such a goofy guy. I would like to consider myself an innocent person…Who takes care of my peoples. Everything I do is out of pure genuine curiosity. Honest to a fault. This loss of Innocence thing people talk about confuses me cause like I reclaimed my innocence a LONG time ago.

Often what we commonly see as original, isn’t original at all. It’s not original to say something others don’t say. It’s original to say something exactly the way you experience it, no matter whether others say it in a similar way or not.

“Originality consists in thinking for yourself, and not in thinking unlike other people”, said J. Fitzjames Stephen

OK done with my Rant ~ Thanks Christina 🙂 I enjoyed reading yours and other peoples feedback. Don’t really know how Lilith works for me but I tried lol

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Christina said:

It took me a while to see just how much 2 there is in your chart! But obviously that Lilith-Pluto opposition across 2-8 is kind of fascinatingly intense and wild – and yes innocent. I think Lilith is about purity and innocence when it’s best expressed and when it’s worst the opposite. Amy Winehouse had Lilith on the MC.

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Wy said:

I agree, lilith is uncorrupted purity when not subdued/thwarted.

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tom-alis-th-mexico said:

I have natal Lilith at 13° Taurus 9th house in a sextile with my natal Saturn at 10° piscis 7th house.
So I don’t know if that’s something but I found myself being really interest in people outside of my country and not of my same culture.
Also right now transit Lilith is a 10° cancer trining my natal saturn exactly and chiron is exactly now at 10° piscis conjunct my natal saturn and opposing my natal chiron at 10° virgo…
so much to think jaja. I have been thinking about my dark side lately.

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Wy said:

i have lilith conjunct moon, Uranus in scorpio square mars opposite chiron. It’s like a bad joke sometimes. Whatever I try to do or just by being around with my energy I provoke people or situations in various ways through these themes. Considering these simultaneous factors it can go anywhere. I’m used to it. There is a beautiful pure intuitive reckless side to it which I’m trying to sublime a bit

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Wy said:

Generally though people can’t figure me out and or see me as a threat

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Wy said:

This with ne-ve conjunct is great for creativity though 🙂

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Eva said:

I love your take on Lilith and everyones comments and experiences but am still not sure where to look for her in my life. Is it because she’s hidden in the 12th? She’s conjunct Jupiter (two minutes apart) in Gemini, conjunct Betelgeuze, the Jupiter of a fixed star. They are opposite Mercury in Sag. in 6th. The opposition is sextile/trine Saturn in Leo in the 3rd. Something about learning/teaching, communication? Not much wildness about me, just wild doubts about everything, always seeing both sides (Gemini?)

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Christina said:

Any planet in the 12th is quite hard to catch hold of, slipping through your fingers like water — but the fact that she’s next to Jupiter must enlarge her in some way. I would make a project to pay attention to transits to that point and see what you come up with.

Wild doubts is already good — Mercury and the third are all about how we think as well as communications. Saturn in the 3rd would likely make you full of doubt anyway, but that questioning and questing (Sag) is probably what makes your mind interesting.

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Eva said:

Thank you very much, Christina. Your response is full of insight. Questioning and questing is very much me! Maybe with this Lilith, I’m forever hunting the wilderness of imagining all the possible answers for the elusive ‘Truth’. Don’t fence me in just one viewpoint, I need open ground 🙂 In fact it makes me think of the cognitive function of Extraverted Intuition which I score high in in the MBTI test and similar.

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Jay said:

I need to understand my Lilith better. I’m a male, 37, and I’ve got Lilith in my 12th house (2 deg Virgo), conjunct my Ascendant (7’09 Virgo) and Saturn (7’14 Virgo), square my 1st deg Gemini Sun and 2nd deg Gemini Midheaven. Lilith is trine my Venus/Mars conjunction in Taurus. My parents’ Pluto is on the 1st deg of Virgo which may explain why I’ve felt oppressed or like I had to give up my power to them and the subsequent rage I feel toward them, specifically toward my father but as I get older I can also see how my mother was manipulative in a sense, or kind of smothering. I’m going through my Pluto square natal Pluto transit now and I feel alot of ‘power issues’ coming to the surface. How can I integrate my Lilith best? Thanks. ~Jay~

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Christina said:

Oh my, that is too big a question to ask here. BUT with that kind of placement, you have got to start working the Lilith. It could also be that you see the world somewhat through her eyes — as an outcast… and that others respond to the Lilith in you unconsciously. I also think this is rather a literary Lilith — do you write?

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Jay said:

Yeah Christina, I’m definitely the black sheep in my family. The bad boy or wild one for sure. I heard Lilith is strong in the 12th. I seem to have a strange effect on people, like I bring things out of them, just with my presence. I don’t really understand it. Even if I’m silent. I could be like some sort of shaman or something. I’m trying to learn to be comfortable with this. I also have an 8th house Aries Moon opposing Pl
uto and trine my Sagittarian Neptune (almost exact-less than a degree).

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